924Board.org

[f15wso]

I have an 82' Euro Spec 924 that died on the road recently here in Spain where I'm stationed in the military. I had it towed to my house, but I still
haven't been able to diagnose the problem.

I thought it was a fuel pump relay problem at first since the pump does not run when the ignition is in the run position. I replaced the relay. The pump still does not operate in the run only position but operates in the start position. I've checked all of the voltages on the leads and they all appear to be good except I'm not sure how to check the lead from terminal 1 of the coil, it shows 12v but I understand it's suppose to be a "trigger" voltage.

I pulled an injector and verified it is spraying fuel when the engine cranks. I have also checked that there is a good spark.

What should I look at next?
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JP
82 924 (non-turbo) Euro Spec

[Ozzie]

The fuel pump sounds OK. It wont continue to run after cranking unless the engine starts.
Check the plugs, leads, rotor and dist cap.
Occasionally the coil pickup in the distributor will fail and no spark is the result.
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Porsche 924 1984 (UK import) NA
Its AUTO and its BLACK
Montego Black on black/red
Engineer of Electro/Mechanical Systems Maintenance

[numbbers]

If there is a good spark at the plugs, then your coil, and the rest of your ignition system is ok. If you have a good spray pattern at the injectors, then your fuel system is ok. So, that would me to expect timing. Any chance your timing belt jumped a tooth?
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1980 924 Turbo

[Mike924]

One way of eliminating the fuel pump relay from the equation is to make a jumper wire and connect it between the 30 and 87 terminals of the relay plug (once the relay is removed). This will power the fuel pump the whole time. If you car still doesn't start, it's not the relay.
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1985 Porsche 924 'Lux', Kalahari Beige (my ex)
1993 Porsche 968 Coupe, Midnight Blue, 6 spd

'There is no substitute for a little grease under your fingernails.' - Chrenan, 924board.org

[f15wso]

First, thanks for all the help! My spanish is limited so I've relying on the Haynes manual and all of your help.

In reference to the suggestions:
Before I bought the new relay,I did connect the jumper across the fuel pump relay circuit and I was able to get the fuel pump to operate. Although the motor still wouldn't start.

I also pulled and injector and it does spray when the engine is cranked.

I also checked the coil and the resistance was out of tolerance for the TCI-H 81-82 system, but within the pre-81 system. A Spanish friend of mine bench tested it at the motor pool and it generates a strong spark. I beleive this car contrary to the manual has the older system non-hall system. It also has the older ignition control unit. The VIN indicates its an 82, the vehicle was sold as a 1981, but the Euro spec systems seem to be pre-81.

I also (carefully) added raw gasoline to the intake just to see if I could get it to fire to decide whether its an ignition of fuel problem. It still didn't even cough.

I'm going to recheck the timing belt tonight. I changed the belt approx 6 months ago when I bought the car, but you never know...
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JP
82 924 (non-turbo) Euro Spec

[f15wso]

jp

[f15wso]

It was the TIMING BELT!

The teeth on the belt are worn off and there's a slight tear on the side of the belt. Everything else seems undamged and it doesn't appear anything collided. I'm not sure how close the valves come to the pistons in this motor when everythings out of sequence.

When I replaced the belt a few months back the new replacement tensioner was different type requiring a shorter bolt. I chose to use the old tensioner, I'm not sure if that led to the failure, I'll replace it now. The tension on the belt was still good and tight, I'm not sure what caused the problem.

Thanks again for the help as soon as I can track down a new belt and tensioner I'm confident it will be running again .

One last question, has anyone else come up against the different tensioners, the original is a little thicker since it has a wrenchead on it to aid in adjustment. Autohaus AZ assures me I have the correct part.
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JP
82 924 (non-turbo) Euro Spec

[Smoothie]

About all you'll find these days are the type that have 2 holes to accept a special tool. They apparently stopped making the old hex-head wrenchable style long ago. You can use the special tool (a VW part), 90 degree snap ring pliers, some have used 2 nails and a screwdriver, I made my own special tool to do it. There's also some kind of bicycle tool that works that Gohim could tell you the name of. Look here - http://www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=6533
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/smoothies931pics/detail?.dir=341f&.dnm=0251.jpg&.src=ph
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/smoothies931pics/detail?.dir=341f&.dnm=c5f7.jpg&.src=ph
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox

[Ozzie]

[f15wso]

I beleive I tracked down the source of the timing belt problem: When I changed the timing belt I also put on all new coolant hoses. It appears that I missalinged one of the hose clamps on one of the hoses that is located in the area above and and behind the the timing belt cover. A very small leak had developed and had been dripping down onto the belt and sprocket. The leak wasn't big enough to make its way all the way to the ground but was large enough to keep the timing belt coated with coolant.
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JP
82 924 (non-turbo) Euro Spec

[Mike924]

[f15wso]

You were right about the timing belt being a common part.

Previously I've tried to buy other parts at the local stores but once I say the word Porsche they just shut down and tell me I need to go to the dealer.

What I do now is look up the part on a Porsche parts related website, get the part number and then Google it. The number usually comes up with some VW parts website with a model that it fits. I then I go to the local parts place and tell them I have VW, give them the part number and everybody is happy. It's worked for relays, filters, timing belts...

One question if anybody knows..
When lining up the timing belt sprocket on the camshaft which mark are you supposed to line up with the valve cover pointer. There's a dimple on the front of the sprocket, a dimple on the engine side of the sprocket and also a paint dot. I've ruled out the dimple on the front side, but I'm not sure about the paint dot vs. the dimple.
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JP
82 924 (non-turbo) Euro Spec

[gohim]

The mark you are looking for the the dimple on the engine side of the camshaft pulley. It is between two teeth.

The timing belt is the same one used on 1.8L VW watercooled engines. Same part also for the timing belt tensioner. That's why the two prong tool for the new model timing belt tensioner is easy to get.

When you switch to the new tensioner, you need to add a spacer, and a new mounting stud.

[Mike924]