924Board.org

[Svobodin]

I have been having trouble getting my car running. The car was running before I replaced the HG. (some of you may have seen my other posts)

Symptoms: Engine is turning over, The spark plugs have a connection. I have roughly adjusted timing so that I hear the engine fire a few cylinders but then the engine dies. There is back pressure coming out of the throttle body.

I used some starting fluid, and poured hot water on the engine to warm it up a bit. The engine turned over, ignited the fluid, died. there was some blow back thru the throttle body, to the point where during one attempt, there was enough pressure blow off the rubber boot from the MAF.

Any suggestions on what to check?

I will list what I have done already.
New starter SR10X (old one was original)
2nd negative lead from battery to engine
2nd negative from engine to ground
(these both helped a lot!)

I'm thinking that the camshaft might be mis-aligned, even tho I lined everything up properly at TDC. I also want to recheck the fuel injectors, making sure they are clean. Any help would be awesome, I really really want to get this car on the road again.

[Grenadiers]

I'd say, STOP!!! Sounds like the ignition is way off, check your TDC, both cam and crank pulleys. Once satisfied with both at TDC, pull your distributor cap and check the rotor alignment.
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'83 944 Track car.
'88 924S Track car.
'89 944 Turbo
2004 Winnebago Vectra monster RV
2012 Jeep Wrangler
2014 Kia Soul
2001 Ford F350 powerstroke

[Svobodin]

when I get home tomorrow, I will be checking the cam alignment, probably by removing and re-installing the cam. I want to check the lifters, to be sure I installed them properly. Then I will be realigning the motor and starting all over again.

I have posted a few threads already about timing, and I think I have that bit sorted out. I have the firing order, and distributor cap arrangement sorted out, but I am just going to start from scratch to see if I overlooked anything.

[MikeDanger]

sounds like you swapped plug wires
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It was either this or a giant box of legos

[ideola]

You either have plug wires on incorrectly or the timing is still off.

Double check firing order: 1-3-4-2 CLOCKWISE!!!! If you have it counter clockwise, it will only run on 2 cylinders.

Double check that you have the cam sprocket on the correct way. Deep side with stamped lettering facing the windshield, use the dimple on that side to set it at TDC.

Go back through the ignition distributor indexing steps I posted in your other threads.

Another possibility is that the locating pin has sheared on the crank pulley, and that what you think is TDC at the crank really isn't.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[Svobodin]

thanks again Ideola, you've been a great help. I'm pretty sure my indexing is correct. with the ignition wire for cylinder 1 followed by 3, 4 and 2 making for a firing order of 1,2,4,3 since the rotor spins counter clockwise.

now if the locating pin sheared off the crank pulley, I could still tell TDC by the piston positions right? When the cylinder head was off the no1 cylinder was at CTDC and that lined up with the crankshaft marker.

I'm finally getting around to trying again today. starting from step one to make sure I haven't missed anything. we will only see I guess. wish me luck!

[ideola]

[Svobodin]

So the flywheel marking, and the crankshaft marking are offset from each other. I'm guessing this isn't a good thing. I'm going to align my camshaft with the TDC of the flywheel. I'll have to see how it goes. I'm afraid this might be the cause of my timing issues.

[Svobodin]

[Ozzie]

[Svobodin]

nooo. sr10x by bosch, I just got my facts wrong, sorry. I thought i had read somewhere it was counter, but I guess I was just high or something lol.

regardless, I'm going to test out my theory about lining up the cam TDC with the flywheel TDC and hope it works...

on a somewhat related note, is there any way to line up the cam pulley with the camshaft when it is removed? I have not done that yet, but if the above doesn't work, I am going to try.

[fiat22turbo]

There's a key in the camshaft that only allows the cam gear to be installed in one direction.

Very easy on a OHC motor to get the timing out of whack. When you get everything lined up with the belt and set the tension, rotate the motor through two complete revolutions and check the timing again. Many times if found I've been a tooth or two off.

Once that is correct, then you can set the distributor timing (also easy to get 180 out, etc.). To make it easy, make a mark on the housing with a magic marker, etc. just below where cylinder number one is located in the cap. Remove the cap and pull the distributor and try to align the rotor to that mark when the distributor is installed. The gear will cause the the rotor to move a bit, so you'll need to do it a few times to get it drop into place where the rotor is lined up.

Then you can install the freshly gapped plugs, rotor and cap. Install the wires so that the order goes 1-3-4-2 in the cap. The rotor will turn clockwise at half the speed of the crankshaft.

You'll also want to check the valve clearances as well, since those can cause issues with starting, idle, etc.

If you are in an area with ethanol mixed gasoline, you'll want to make sure the fuel is fresh (within a few months) or you may experience hard starting issues.

With all of the above sorted you'll want to either install a remote crank button or have a friend crank it over while you manually adjust the distributor timing to get it started and warmed enough to allow final adjustment of base timing using the manual and a timing light. Once set, lock the distributor in place and shut the motor down and verify it will start.

Next, you'll want to verify control pressures and set idle speed. To do that you'll need a CIS pressure testing setup. You can buy one or build one, there are details around here. Luckily, the Bosch CIS system is similar to the one used on Volvo, VW, Audi and other cars of the time, so a local shop might be able to help you out if you get stuck.

The FSM's and a book on Bosch CIS systems will help a lot with in depth knowledge on troubleshooting and adjusting the systems.

Good luck!
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Stefan
1979 924 Carrera GTS (clone-ish)
1988 944 Turbo S (Silver Rose)

[Svobodin]

Thanks for the detailed post, but the fuel pump went bad last night so all work has stopped.

I was going to replace it anyway, now I just have to... may as well clean the fuel sender and the tank as well while i'm at it.