924Board.org

[B]

Hey guys

As I have been trying to go through some of my cooling/intercooling options for my turbo as I add a little boost, I came across the water injection option.
I noticed a few people had gone this route (I think Smoothie and Tuurbo) and I wondered how well that has worked and if you thought it was an avenue to think about or stay away from?

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

thanks
Sean
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1979 924 n/a
BAE turbo
5-speed snailshell

[ideola]

Least expensive and easiest-to-implement path to cool the charge. It's not a substitute for a true intercooler, but it is affordable and effective.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[B]

I know Corky Bell recommends against it - but after reading some of the posts it sounded viable and worthwhile to at least look into. I was not sure if anyone had found out if using the methanol or window washer fluid had ultimately bothered the aluminum in our cars - or if was ok.

Some of the intercoolers I had been looking at were rather inexpensive - ($40 plus shipping) so I was not 100% confident in those either. But I suppose that the idea that some intercooler is better than none at all.?

thanks

Sean
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1979 924 n/a
BAE turbo
5-speed snailshell

[ideola]

I seriously doubt that windshield solvent would have any significant affect on the intake manifold or head. The solvent should be atomized when being injected, and will burn off in the combustion chamber. Might be a different story if the alu was immersed in the solvent for a while, but at these volumes, I don't see it being an issue.

IMO, water/meth injection is still a viable option. Plenty of examples beyond the two 931s you mentioned above where it is being used to good effect on other platforms.

As for your last question, "some intercooler is better than none at all", no, that's not true at all. You need the intercooler to be properly sized for the CFM you're producing...too big and you lose flow, too small and you introduce restriction. You also want the heat exchanger to be effective, and there are several options to consider.

A while ago, I actually spoke with Gerhard @ Bell Intercoolers almost exactly 2 years ago. Rather than repeat everything, here is an excellent thread where I was going through my eval on the intercooler design, with tons of discussion around the various design considerations. I think you'll find this thread will help supplement what you've doubtless already read in Chapter 5 of Maximum Boost.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[poorsha924]

Hi Sean
I was reading your article & saw you have 79 snailshell w/ the BAE setup I am in process of put a BAE setup on mine its also a 79 snailshell I have a spare motor on a engine stand to use for template to get all the bugs worked out before putting it on . I plan on tapping in to the oil cooler sanwich plate for the oil feed to the turbo insterad of teeing into the back of the head since ther is so much room NOT! & have a 924 turbo oil pan with the factory hole in the side for the return what do you think? how are you running your oil feed & return? would you have any suggestions on do's & don't since you have "been there done that "about the installation of the turbo set up? Just trying to make good choices before going under the knife. Like they say" measure twice cut once"
About the water iinjection thing sound very interesting how were going to go about it love to know. Iam reading on the other threads about it too! 85MPH speedos are SO WRONG!!!

any light you could shed on this would be greatly appreciated
Thanks!
Steve ")
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79 924S snailshell
audi big bore t-body
16" turbo wheels

[ideola]

You might be interested in the actual BAE installation instructions, if you haven't seen them already...
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[B]

nice assortment of pics and instructions Dan

Steve
That idea sounds like it should work - but I do not want to say for sure. I pretty much followed the instructions. The connection on the back is annoying to say the least - if I remember right when I talked to Andrew about it when I was first getting started, he had issues with that as well.
I tried to eliminate that by moving the sending unit to the fender. by doing that it is easier to see and get at the connection. All that I had done was run a small section of hose to the sending unit, use a bracket I had laying around (that luckily fit about perfectly) used the T there and connected from there to the turbo. I still feel the need to check the connection frequently but it seems fine so far.
I want to say that someone else used a connection similar to your idea but I cannot remember.

Sean
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1979 924 n/a
BAE turbo
5-speed snailshell

[ideola]

If you go the sandwich adapter route, this also provides the option of fitting an oil cooler, which would be a good idea on a turbo-charged car. I have an oil cooler setup, including the sandwich adapter, heat exchanger and remote filter mount that I might be willing to part with if somebody wants it. You'll need to get your own lines, however, as I removed it when one of the non-steel braided lines got punctured.

Regardless, I much prefer the sandwich adapter route as the fitting on the back of the head is non-standard. IMO, best not to mess with it, leave the stock sender there and plumb from the sandwich adapter.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[B]

hind sight being 20/20 - . . . I would probably do that as well. I put the remote oil filter kit on. But for some reason did not think of it at the time.

Sean
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1979 924 n/a
BAE turbo
5-speed snailshell

[924OZY]

Hi,
Regarding the water injection, I have a magazine article here somewhere where it increased the efficiency of the turbo by 17%.

They did it using a spare universal washer bottle with pump, then attatched the flexible clear tubing, this was melted and squashed (i think they heated up the end of some pliers) at the end, and then pin holes were added till the right amount of water was found. In the end it 3 pin holes was perfect.

You can get nozzles, and programmable set ups with injectors, but if using the crimped tube way, no parts can fall into your intake stream. Also apparantly, a washer bottle set up, can supply more than enough water pressure and volume than one would ever need.

One thing mentioned was not to do it too close to the front of the Turbo, as the water can actually sort of cut the compressor wheel.

Anyway, for about $20 or less, its the cheapest and most effective hp per dollar water injection available.
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924 N/A snailshell, superpro linkage bushes, 2.5"exhaust

4.0L ef Fairmont, 3000rpm stall, shift-kit, J3 chip, 3" exhaust, self tuned using tunerpro, soon to be boosted,
expecting 350Kw at wheels at 10psi.

[ideola]

Injecting water before the turbo is a Really Bad Idea.
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[Min]

[poorsha924]

Hi Ideola
thanks for the link of the instructions for the BAE setup installation once again you have the answer for the question
Poorsha924
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79 924S snailshell
audi big bore t-body
16" turbo wheels

[Joes924Racer]

good post interesting idea: water injection. Oh dont mind me just wanted to show that i was reading posts.
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1979 porsche 924 Na
1980 porsche Turbo 931GT Replica
Have u ever driven a turbo.

[Tas931]