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E-Ram electric supercharger on 924
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Rich H  



Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 2665
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do it.
You would get on well with 'Mr Broadsider' with his bling and boost gauge on his N/A
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1994 Lotus Esprit S4 - Work in progress...
1980 Porsche 924 S2 DITC Turbo - Original spec
1978 Homo-Sapiens - Tired spec
1953 Landrover S1 - Pensioner Spec
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Slade Gunar  



Joined: 26 Dec 2009
Posts: 16
Location: Alburtis Pa

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

heh oh well.... i was warned formally about posting on any forum, guess now i know why.

my mods to the 924 are mine, and they do work regardless of how anyone views them or what they think about it, like a actual coupler that isnt the audi throttlebody oval that repeats itself down the intake boot (check it sometime) and yes even my coloured SILICON hoses *gasp!!* my bling bling as you call my *AN 10* lines and heat sheilded cracked ugly ass fuel lines *tinfoil* dare i try and use something other than cloth braided shitlines? may god strike me dead.

i was trying to help out others here but i understand that this is your world and as such someone like me who thinks too far outside of the box would not be able to coexist with the rest. i wish you all the best of luck.

and for the record this goes without saying, do not attempt any of my mods. which i know no one will, but i enjoy being the only 924 on the planet with them
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~Devils 24~ 82' 924
grey market euro 80' 924
1985 3oozx Turbo Z31
1986 RX7 Auto FC3
1987 Supra Turbo MA70
so many cars, so little space......
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morghen  



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 9095
Location: Romania

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

enjoy your car as you see fit...just dont expect people to agree with you especially if you know that you think "out of the box"

In any case dont underestimate us...there are lots of out of the box thinkers here who have done more than you would ever imagine on the 924.

Our method of aproach is way different than strapping tinfoil and cheap parts..why you might ask? well many reasons...some of us are really racing and expect longevity aswell as high performance, some of us are grand tourers and expect mileage and reliability...some are porsche purrists (924 level purrists) and the list goes on.
you will find this board as a grown up unit of people...thats why some of us reacted this way to your..thinking.

if you are into performance modding your 924 may i suggest you start by cleaning up your engine bay(perhaps re-thinking that heat protection system) and going for a full cyl head job and a bushings and suspension upgrade.
i'm quite sure that if you do this your car will feel much more together and the engine will produce a bit more power.

oh and for the record most of us have heavly modded 924s.
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Slade Gunar  



Joined: 26 Dec 2009
Posts: 16
Location: Alburtis Pa

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i figured that. sorry im gonna stick to what i know best. i was trying to avoid head work on this car of any kind to get power, the 924 was fun for awhile and cool as a first car but i guess but its time to move on, i got a 3.2 ported supra turbo thats been sitting for too long now. the 924 just isnt worth what you put in compared to what you get out of it to me. im no purist, lest of all with a porsche of any kind, i view it more of a audi or a vw. but im not gonna b on here anymore after this, i realize now these 2 cars dont really hold any intrest to me anymore. thank you for helping me realize this and finaly be able to let go of them, if anything it was worth that in itself.
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~Devils 24~ 82' 924
grey market euro 80' 924
1985 3oozx Turbo Z31
1986 RX7 Auto FC3
1987 Supra Turbo MA70
so many cars, so little space......
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joejax  



Joined: 02 Dec 2009
Posts: 919
Location: Jacksonville,FLA,USA

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Slade, welcome to the forum, stick around man, this place is always in need of different ideas.
Even if you get blasted for something, there might be someone out there that can benefit or improve on an idea.
There is a wealth of info here on things that will work and will not work. It seems everything has been tried.

There are plenty who want better performance without spending a boat-load of money.
The things these people have done to their cars is inspiring, if only money were no obstacle .
I'm working on a Top 10 list of mods from here to do to my car,.... then getting a second job .

I also believe these cars are more valuable in their uniqueness than other cars. I mean, how many others do you see on the road?
Sure we have to live with the 'that's not a real Porsche" crowd, it only makes the bond stronger.

It has become my duty to keep this car alive, just to see the look on their face as I go zooming by .
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Uhhh...you got any pics?
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bnoon  



Joined: 12 Oct 2009
Posts: 607
Location: West Des Moines, IA USA

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rich H wrote:
The red 924 used to belong to the UK 924 OC chairman Martin and I had a good hard look at it's install done by apparently professional installers who had done loads before. It was quite a neat install - until the switchgear they installed failed (Which consisted of a microswitch at WOT and a 20A fuse) The flat plate was simply a bit of black plywood that clipped into the standard airbox - It cost him £600


Sorry, but using plywood to mount to the airbox and using 20 amp fuse for something that draws 40-50 amps of power at full load?!?!?! Your friend got ripped off on the install it sounds like.

Rich H wrote:

My Hydroplane motor (3phase, brushless) draws up to 150A at 7.4 volts, (Just not for long!) that's just over 1kW or 1.5 HP. The motor is water cooled as is the speed controller. The wiring is all very thick and very short and gets pretty hot. The car battery will provide huge power to the starter but the wiring and solenoid contactor are very heavy duty - The wiring used on that ERam on Martins car was standard gauge automotive wire and it was 20A fused (Professionally installed!) 12V * 20A = 240W = 0.3HP max The whole lot was switched through a microswitch.


The Eram comes with a microswitch, yes, but that's just a trigger switch. The power to the fan comes from a 50 amp automotive relay through 10 gauge wire. Also, your math is correct for finding power, but a 20 amp fuse does not limit the power to the load, the resistance of the load determines the amp draw, which as I stated above can be 40-50 amps. Power drawn by the electric motor has nothing to do with how much power the engine will gain by eliminating the vacuum in the intake though.

Rich H wrote:

By all means continue to tell me how good it is - I will continue to believe it's a load of old ballcocks. But that is my experience of Martin's ERam.

To convince me I would need to see a compressor plot, explanation of how a bent metal fan and small 12V motor can provide measureable boost and dyno runs done pre and post installation (Not just fan on/off) by a reputable outfit. Do that and I'll buy one tomorrow.


I tried to go find my dyno plots from our contour.org KC 99 meet, searched for 2 hours in the contour.org archives. But alas, I couldn't find it. It's been 10 years after all. How time flies...

But that doesn't stop me from saying the following: It (the Eram) doesn't have to make positive pressure to make power. Why? Because the air intake systems in most cars run under a vacuum, especially at WOT in higher RPM's. Feed more air into the intake system and you eliminate some or even all of the intake vacuum, just like putting on a CAI or short ram filter, or heck, even connecting a flexible tube to the front grill to feed fresh air into the airbox. My personal gains related in my other post are in the realm of 1 psi of gain, which was right in line with the HP/TQ gains I recorded. Other people have used a vacuum/psi gauge and recorded similar gains.

All of that said, I wouldn't buy one again. Mostly because I do not plan on buying another NA car ever again. Real boost is just to addictive. For the money, there are better mods out there to start with. Much better...
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1986 Porsche 944 Turbo - SOLD!
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Rocco R16V  



Joined: 03 May 2009
Posts: 497
Location: PNW

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

for better results use a large bilge pump blower, these can move more air and create lots more pressure than the design your using.
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Scorpio  



Joined: 05 Jul 2007
Posts: 1957
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
heh oh well.... i was warned formally about posting on any forum, guess now i know why.


Man up and defend your ideas!

The majority of critics havent actually installed a system..YOU HAVE..youve seen the improvements... If youre scared to defend your ideas then maybe a 924 isnt for you, they require balls and patience
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MS1..EFI..
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Think mean think fast
all youll see is
my Porsches Arse!!!
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Rich H  



Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 2665
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What he said. As above - it's your car - I EFI'd an N/A for goodness sake.
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1994 Lotus Esprit S4 - Work in progress...
1980 Porsche 924 S2 DITC Turbo - Original spec
1978 Homo-Sapiens - Tired spec
1953 Landrover S1 - Pensioner Spec
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Martijnus  



Joined: 29 Dec 2006
Posts: 2019
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pics don't work for me

any specs on the blower? what's the displacement?
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"Rule: Turbo's make torque, and torque makes fun." (C. Bell)

924 "50-jahre", 1981.
MSII/extra, LPG, ITB's, 5lug.
To be turbo'ed in a while.
Killed her at the Nurburgring, Porscheless at the moment
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Maybe924  



Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 412
Location: New London, CT

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rocco R16V wrote:
for better results use a large bilge pump blower, these can move more air and create lots more pressure than the design your using.


Don't they require water for lubrication and cooling? On a related note an electric blower is DAF.
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bnoon  



Joined: 12 Oct 2009
Posts: 607
Location: West Des Moines, IA USA

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rocco R16V wrote:
for better results use a large bilge pump blower, these can move more air and create lots more pressure than the design your using.


Hahahahahahahaha!Not a chance in hell!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NncTM9DEf8Y
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Rocco R16V  



Joined: 03 May 2009
Posts: 497
Location: PNW

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ha ha, well of course not if you buy the cheapest one you could find.
I did say a large bilge blower.
http://www.outdoorsuperstore.com/product.asp?prod=258926
a quick search, there are even bigger ones.

These can help reduce the vacuum or build a tiny amount of pressure and produce a small amount of power if the fueling can adapt.

I personally think the gain is not worth the cost and would never use one, but to say they dont work without any first hand knowledge isnt right. i would guess the air flow isnt enough and the only gain is to be had at just off throttle where you dont drive anyway.

good for slade, he tried something new and unproven.


Edit: oh and his test was flawed, the bilge blower design needs some back pressure to work properly. he could have quadrupled the cfm by blocking 3/4 of the outlet on that blower. when you take a blower like that and start blocking the outlet you can hear the motor ramp up and feel more air coming out. BTDT (Former HVAC tech)
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Last edited by Rocco R16V on Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15550
Location: Spring Lake MI

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rocco R16V wrote:
http://www.outdoorsuperstore.com/product.asp?prod=258926


OTOH, that unit would make a nice upgrade for the heater blower

Hmmm....
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simsport  



Joined: 06 Nov 2002
Posts: 573
Location: UK Warrington

PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:01 am    Post subject: May have a use Reply with quote

Whilst I hear and accept all that has been said about the eram I must admit to a hankering to see what if anything it might do to a roots supercharged car feeding the blower. The roots is sensistive to good air flow into it and so I wondered if it might help that by feeding the blower.

It would not be a closed system hence no pressure just flow. To be sure it did not restrict the flow at full chat it would be in a second leg with its own intake/air filter but pointed at the blower inlet.

Just a thought.

Cheers
simon
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